posted on 18/11/2020 20:06Difficult to fully flesh out my thoughts in a few lines - arty_fufkin
Without leaving myself open to attack from pretty much any side.
But in a nutshell:
There was clearly an issue with antisemitism.
The leadership failed to adequately deal with it.
It was right to have an independent enquiry.
Starmer was right to accept the findings and act upon it.
Corbyn should have accepted the findings, even if he thought it was somewhat harsh.
Starmer had little choice but to suspend him.
I don't accept Corbyn is an antisemite.
Following his apology and acceptance of the report (gritted teeth not withstanding), allowing him back in but withholding the whip is probably the best compromise pending the due process.
The 2 extreme and fanatical responses from Corbyn die hards and those demanding the ultimate sanctions are utterly depressing.
Labour won't move on from this without an acceptance we've made a mess of this and a willingness to also accept that shouldn't mean defenestration of anyone deemed to have acted ineffectively.
The only winners are the Conservative Party, whose record of bigotry is hilariously overlooked. But we know the press will do this, so can't resort to whataboutery since we know the way of the world.
I joined the Labour Party because of Corbyn and particularly the manifesto of 2017. I'm still broadly supportive of his overall position but the last election demonstrated beyond doubt he is never going to pursuade the majority he is in anyway a viable leader so demands for him to be leader again are utterly insane.
I'm worried we will remain in a civil war while the worst government this country has EVER had somehow drive the country to ruin and get voted in again.
That's probably it.
- <stirs the pot> - Gav 18/11 11:27 (read 19247 times, 26 posts in thread)
- Re: <stirs the pot> - Gramsci. 19/11 00:50 (read 15468 times)
- Re: <stirs the pot> - Gramsci. 19/11 10:35 (read 16078 times)
- which hard left, apologist publication did I lift that from? - Gramsci. 19/11 14:51 (read 16324 times)
- Re: <stirs the pot> - Gramsci. 19/11 10:35 (read 16078 times)
- for years I thought she was a tory - eaststandman 18/11 12:13 (read 16902 times)
- not a chance ... its a subject matter where no debate is allowed ... nt - EmCee 18/11 11:39 (read 17069 times)
- Re: not a chance ... its a subject matter where no debate is allowed ... nt - Gramsci. 18/11 19:36 (read 17149 times)
- Re: not a chance ... its a subject matter where no debate is allowed ... nt - Nicolae 19/11 08:20 (read 17301 times)
- Re: not a chance ... its a subject matter where no debate is allowed ... nt - Gramsci. 19/11 10:10 (read 17407 times)
- do you really, really want to know? - Gramsci. 19/11 10:11 (read 17460 times)
- go on, treat me to the full text link - Nicolae 19/11 10:30 (read 17768 times)
- I thought you'd be familiar with it already - Gramsci. 19/11 10:37 (read 17794 times)
- I was watching Chris Williamson on The Canary feed last night - Nicolae 19/11 11:33 (read 18004 times)
- Do you agree with the extract I posted up there though? As a libertarian - Gramsci. 19/11 11:36 (read 17891 times)
- Why wouldn't I (assuming it is indeed legally correct)? I have no beef with it whatsoever. - Nicolae 19/11 11:59 (read 17961 times)
- So if you agree with it, why did you suggest it came from an "apologist publication"? - Gramsci. 19/11 12:00 (read 18098 times)
- Well who else would pen it at this precise time, given these precise circumstances, other than a hard left, apologist publication (which it turned out it was) ? - Nicolae 19/11 12:14 (read 17956 times)
- How about --------> the EHRC report itself*? - Gramsci. 19/11 12:27 (read 17970 times)
- Arf! Wonderful to watch - Robin Ho 19/11 13:31 (read 17823 times)
- Re: How about the EHRC report itself*? - Nicolae 19/11 13:27 (read 17768 times)
- any chance ROR can show as much outrage at the Tory party forgiving Fabricant and his Anglo -Muslim comments - eaststandman 19/11 13:13 (read 17770 times)
- How about --------> the EHRC report itself*? - Gramsci. 19/11 12:27 (read 17970 times)
- Well who else would pen it at this precise time, given these precise circumstances, other than a hard left, apologist publication (which it turned out it was) ? - Nicolae 19/11 12:14 (read 17956 times)
- So if you agree with it, why did you suggest it came from an "apologist publication"? - Gramsci. 19/11 12:00 (read 18098 times)
- Why wouldn't I (assuming it is indeed legally correct)? I have no beef with it whatsoever. - Nicolae 19/11 11:59 (read 17961 times)
- Do you agree with the extract I posted up there though? As a libertarian - Gramsci. 19/11 11:36 (read 17891 times)
- I was watching Chris Williamson on The Canary feed last night - Nicolae 19/11 11:33 (read 18004 times)
- I thought you'd be familiar with it already - Gramsci. 19/11 10:37 (read 17794 times)
- go on, treat me to the full text link - Nicolae 19/11 10:30 (read 17768 times)
- do you really, really want to know? - Gramsci. 19/11 10:11 (read 17460 times)
- Re: not a chance ... its a subject matter where no debate is allowed ... nt - Gramsci. 19/11 10:10 (read 17407 times)
- Re: not a chance ... its a subject matter where no debate is allowed ... nt - Nicolae 19/11 08:20 (read 17301 times)
- I thought the independent EHRC had opined and that was final. - Nicolae 18/11 13:19 (read 17664 times)
- It has and it was - arty_fufkin 18/11 16:19 (read 17228 times)
- Re: It has and it was - Nicolae 18/11 18:03 (read 16628 times)
- Difficult to fully flesh out my thoughts in a few lines - arty_fufkin 18/11 20:06 (read 16353 times)
- Excellent post, probably the best and most honest / heartfelt summary I've read by anyone ./ - Nicolae 18/11 20:10 (read 15645 times)
- Difficult to fully flesh out my thoughts in a few lines - arty_fufkin 18/11 20:06 (read 16353 times)
- Re: It has and it was - Nicolae 18/11 18:03 (read 16628 times)
- It has and it was - arty_fufkin 18/11 16:19 (read 17228 times)
- Re: not a chance ... its a subject matter where no debate is allowed ... nt - Gramsci. 18/11 19:36 (read 17149 times)
- Re: <stirs the pot> - Gramsci. 19/11 00:50 (read 15468 times)